Mazurka

High School Chemistry Check-in Thread

Recommended Posts

Mazurka

On the high school check-in thread, we've been talking a bit about the Discovering Design with Chemistry, and some of us thought a chemistry check-in thread might be helpful.  Feel free to come here and chat about chemistry, regardless of the program you are using.  We can support each other and our students as we maneuver through this sometimes-difficult subject. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka

Ben is finishing up  the second chapeter of Discovering Design. I think he is working on the review questions today.  Sometimes I have my students do the extra practice problems on the website.  It depends on how they do with the Review Questions. Just thought I would mention this in case some of you weren't aware that there are extra problems on the website. There are also helpful videos and links, but so far neither of my students have been keen to use them. 

My older son just did this program last year, so I'm in the midst of two years of chemistry in a row.  Ben wanted to do chem this year rather than biology, so I figured, why not?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Derf

I am totally impressed with Dr wiles new chemistry......and have the book...but due to my student not really needing such a detailed course due to his future plans, we are using Friendly Chemistry...as it is not as math heavy and my student is still struggling with algebra 1. But i read thru some of it and worked out the math problems to test if it was something he could handle...and yes it is far superior to Apologia's new revised edition.

I had the same problem with Biology....really like apologias book but it was way more detail and information than my student was interested in and needed...i feel it is on the level of a basic General biology college class ( i am a bio major and have the notes left from college yet to compare the two to get that assumption) and was working really hard to adapt the Biology to a more user friendly level and pace for someone who was quickly starting to hate science due to the detail and his lack of interest in science when i learned of Friendly biology..... it had just been released in the spring of 2017. So i got a hold of it and  we started over again in January. We stopped last spring at  lesson 21 as that is where they started the anatomy/ physiology section of lessons and therefore are finsishing that part along with the ecology this fall and early winter. Understanding and his interest are the key to learning and so i am happy to have found  Friendly biology as it saved me a ton of work and also got him back inot feeling he wasn't a total failure. Then  i investigated Friendly chemistry...another win for my student...so that is where we are at for when we finish Friendly biology  later this fall  or early winter. 

But i still have Dr Wiles Chemistry book....and can use that as a reference to anything i want to add to Friendly chemistry.    Marne

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka
6 hours ago, Derf said:

I am totally impressed with Dr wiles new chemistry......and have the book...but due to my student not really needing such a detailed course due to his future plans, we are using Friendly Chemistry...as it is not as math heavy and my student is still struggling with algebra 1. But i read thru some of it and worked out the math problems to test if it was something he could handle...and yes it is far superior to Apologia's new revised edition.

I had the same problem with Biology....really like apologias book but it was way more detail and information than my student was interested in and needed...i feel it is on the level of a basic General biology college class ( i am a bio major and have the notes left from college yet to compare the two to get that assumption) and was working really hard to adapt the Biology to a more user friendly level and pace for someone who was quickly starting to hate science due to the detail and his lack of interest in science when i learned of Friendly biology..... it had just been released in the spring of 2017. So i got a hold of it and  we started over again in January. We stopped last spring at  lesson 21 as that is where they started the anatomy/ physiology section of lessons and therefore are finsishing that part along with the ecology this fall and early winter. Understanding and his interest are the key to learning and so i am happy to have found  Friendly biology as it saved me a ton of work and also got him back inot feeling he wasn't a total failure. Then  i investigated Friendly chemistry...another win for my student...so that is where we are at for when we finish Friendly biology  later this fall  or early winter. 

But i still have Dr Wiles Chemistry book....and can use that as a reference to anything i want to add to Friendly chemistry.    Marne

Thanks for your input, Marne. 

I may look into Friendly Biology for my son who is doing high school chemistry right now. He is my student who wants to be an engineer, and he really doesn't have that much interest in Biology.  Because he did Apologia Physical Science last year in 9th grade, he only has two years left after this one, and he may be better served using those two years for a a couple of physics classes.  Still, I would like him to take a biology course. I  think every student should have at least a basic biology course, and maybe Friendly Biology would be more appealing to him.

My older son is taking biology at the community college right now, and the preparation he received from Apologia Biology and Wile's new chemistry book have well-prepared him for his college course.  His college biology course draws from both high school biology and high school chemistry.  He has been balancing equations in biology, and I asked him if they were hard, and he said they were much easier than the ones in Wile's new chem book.   That's what he said, anyhow.  We're awaiting the results of his first exam, so I guess we'll then see how well he really learned them, lol.   At any rate,  I'm so grateful he had both chemistry and biology before taking this college course. 

Edited by Mazurka

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Derf

i love the pic with your dog.....we have aussies so i have seen that look before...our  blue merle   ( his name is SKY)really likes to get close like that and will have that "look" on his face also. Those herding dogs are just so smart!

Anyway I was going to give a bit more information about Dr Wiles books for those that might be interested also...   I also at one point had a copy of apologies 3rd edition chemistry due to the fact that I had ordered a used 2nd edition book froma lady...i forget where she was from BUT the post office lost it. This was about the time when 2nd edition were getting REALLY scarce due to everyone wanting that one rather than messing with the new one. Dr Wile had at that point said he wasn't going to write another so i dug around till i found a 2nd edition and then the post office lost it....and months later they sent me what they claimed were my books. It turned out to be the 3rd edition....now the lady said her book WAS the 2nd edition...and i really do believe her...but as the post office really doesn't know the difference I am sure...that is what I got anyway. SO as long as i had the book i looked them over real well...comparing them to what Dr Wile had said was in error and what he didn't like about the way they were set up...and even though I am NOT as familiar with chemistry as biology...I could see that Dr Wile was being totally honest in his opinion of the book...  i sold them. Then Dr Wile announced he would write a new chemistry  book and i got a hold of that instead.

I spent a whole summer reading thru the Apologia Biology book, making a schedule that would be more at the pace my student could handle...rewriting the 1st few tests, and figuring out how i was going to make this work for my student...and  that fall after we finished Physical Science that we had to slow down from the previous school year. ( I figured SLOW with understanding and retainment was better than flunking and not really getting anything out of it) we started biology. It was, a real disaster even with my adjusted schedule, rewritten tests and making them open book. He was not getting it and very discouraged...and you know the rest. After doing all that work and finding Friendly biology which was so much a better fit for my student WITHOUT all the work i had put into the apologia Biology, I just decided to buy Friendly chemistry...and i am reading thru it now to prepare for teaching chemistry as i am not as familiar with it as biology....I find the chemistry just as "FRIENDLY" as the biology was and still will give him a good high school level chemistry background.   Marne

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Gilead

Well, we're using BJU chemistry with the student book and classroom videos online. DD is doing labs at our co-op and today was the first day of co-op. They spent class time (1.5 hr) going over safety rules. I was glad to hear this because they're working in a carpeted classroom (not a lab area) and two years ago she and a friend melted the upholstery on one of the chairs by putting the heat lamp too close during physical science class! She needs those safety rules. She enjoys the BJU reading but is already telling me she doesn't want to spend time on the video. I am going to insist as this is one of my weakest areas and I don't even want to try to help her with it.

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka
On 9/13/2018 at 9:32 PM, Derf said:

i love the pic with your dog.....we have aussies so i have seen that look before...our  blue merle   ( his name is SKY)really likes to get close like that and will have that "look" on his face also. Those herding dogs are just so smart!

We love our Border Collie! She is a piece of work, for sure.   We considered Aussies and Shelties as well.   Aussies seems a little more mellow than Border Collies, but I wonder if that is an illusion, lol. 

On 9/13/2018 at 9:32 PM, Derf said:

Anyway I was going to give a bit more information about Dr Wiles books for those that might be interested also...   I also at one point had a copy of apologies 3rd edition chemistry due to the fact that I had ordered a used 2nd edition book froma lady...i forget where she was from BUT the post office lost it. This was about the time when 2nd edition were getting REALLY scarce due to everyone wanting that one rather than messing with the new one. Dr Wile had at that point said he wasn't going to write another so i dug around till i found a 2nd edition and then the post office lost it....and months later they sent me what they claimed were my books. It turned out to be the 3rd edition....now the lady said her book WAS the 2nd edition...and i really do believe her...but as the post office really doesn't know the difference I am sure...that is what I got anyway. SO as long as i had the book i looked them over real well...comparing them to what Dr Wile had said was in error and what he didn't like about the way they were set up...and even though I am NOT as familiar with chemistry as biology...I could see that Dr Wile was being totally honest in his opinion of the book...  i sold them. Then Dr Wile announced he would write a new chemistry  book and i got a hold of that instead.

I spent a whole summer reading thru the Apologia Biology book, making a schedule that would be more at the pace my student could handle...rewriting the 1st few tests, and figuring out how i was going to make this work for my student...and  that fall after we finished Physical Science that we had to slow down from the previous school year. ( I figured SLOW with understanding and retainment was better than flunking and not really getting anything out of it) we started biology. It was, a real disaster even with my adjusted schedule, rewritten tests and making them open book. He was not getting it and very discouraged...and you know the rest. After doing all that work and finding Friendly biology which was so much a better fit for my student WITHOUT all the work i had put into the apologia Biology, I just decided to buy Friendly chemistry...and i am reading thru it now to prepare for teaching chemistry as i am not as familiar with it as biology....I find the chemistry just as "FRIENDLY" as the biology was and still will give him a good high school level chemistry background.   Marne

This is good information.  Thanks for sharing.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka
14 hours ago, Gilead said:

Well, we're using BJU chemistry with the student book and classroom videos online. DD is doing labs at our co-op and today was the first day of co-op. They spent class time (1.5 hr) going over safety rules. I was glad to hear this because they're working in a carpeted classroom (not a lab area) and two years ago she and a friend melted the upholstery on one of the chairs by putting the heat lamp too close during physical science class!

She needs those safety rules. She enjoys the BJU reading but is already telling me she doesn't want to spend time on the video. I am going to insist as this is one of my weakest areas and I don't even want to try to help her with it.

 

My kids don't always enjoy watching videos, either.  And if I confess, I probably don't as well.  I'd rather read because it's quicker.  

And yikes about the upholstery!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Derf

I know this isn't chemistry....well maybe it is...as  our aussies sure are ACTIVE....:girlhaha:  ummm...I have had aussies for a while and even had a 1/2 border/ 1/2 aussies ...he was top notch....the real difference between them i think is that they herd different....borders use eye...you can get away with that with sheep...but no self respecting cow is going to move by you giving them a look ... so aussies were our choice as we dairy. Aussies herd by positioning themselves and moving to influence that Space a cow will tolerate the dog in....our 1/2 border1/2 aussie could work both ways...so he was quite the treasure.... But i sure can't know the ones we have had or have now either. They are super energetic and as our breeder emphsizes  temperment...we have dogs which are very well socialized. I think from my observations of both the Borders can be more shy till they get to know you.... but again a lot of that is how you bring them up also. Our Sky's mother is more shy...but he is not like that. Had him at the vet  this week to get meds for a cow with pink eye...and I had to wait a while so she said to bring him in while i waited   as it was hot. He was a complete gentleman....  and he is only a year old. Of course he is a way more rambunctious at home....as he is more comfortable...but he walked in and behaved perfectly. I guess the obedience training and going the couple of breed shows for conformation classes paid off as he is just a farm dog here and not off the place excpt for when he rides shotgun for a trip to the vet or feed mill.

Edited by Derf
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka
1 minute ago, Derf said:

I know this isn't chemistry....well maybe it is...as  our aussies sure are ACTIVE....:girlhaha:  ummm...I have had aussies for a while and even had a 1/2 border/ 1/2 aussies ...he was top notch....the real difference between them i think is that they herd difference....aussies use eye...you can get a ways with that with sheep...but no self respecting cow is going to move by you giving them a look ... so aussies were our choice as we dairy. Aussies herd by positioning themselves and moving to influence that Space a cow will tolerate the dog in....our 1/2 boprder 1/2 aussie could work both ways...so he was quite the treasure.... But i sure can't know the ones we have had or have now either. They are super energetic and as our breeder emphsizes  temperment...we have dogs which are very well socialized. I think from my observations of both the Borders can be more shy till they get to know you.... but again a lot of that is how you bring them up also. Our Sky's mother is more shy...but he is not like that. Had him at the vet  this week to get meds for a cow with pink eye...and I had to wait a while so she said to bring him in while i waited    hop

That's very interesting about the differences.

I confess, we didn't do a great job socializing our BC because we didn't know any better.  A lot of vets are not even really that familiar with the BC.  We were told not to bring her around other dogs and even people until she got all of her shots, but that was a mistake.  She is very skittish around other people, although loving and loyal to us.  If she invites you into her inner circle, she'll love you for life, but she will not let any strangers near her.   She is better than she used to be.  She'll now sit by my husband if he talks to a stranger, but we are always having to tell people not to go up and pet her.  If I'd have it to do over again, that puppy would be going out and meeting with people and other dogs every week.  Her dad was such a wonderful, friendly dog, and I had hoped that she would be like him, but I guess we didn't socialize her correctly.  Oh well, we still love her.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Derf

I had to edit as i wasn't finsished giving you the whole story...and wammo the computer decided all by itself that i was done.....:swoon::yes::girlhaha:  anyhow  yes it is really good to socialize puppies...and I even took Sky over to our breeders again when he a about 3 months old to see if he knew what to do with the baby goats....yup....he did!  I took him back this summer and we showed him sheep and introduced him to things a bit...and it is there. i also have had around our calves and he SEES cows all the time when outside and taken him in the barn on leash when they are milking and so far no fear of those BIG holsteins. Course when he gets kicked the 1st time will tell the story...but it WILL happen as that is normal and will see if he is still ok with it. They either get fearful, or just keep on working or even get mad and chomp the cow one. Our older aussies at age 1 1/2 got mad and chomped the cow.m when kicked the 1st time..he has no fear of cows at all...and seems to know how to protect himself instinctively now. He is really sharp.

We had Sky at a obedience class at age 9 months...he did VERY well...got 2nd place in the class and again when people come i make sure he is around them and TRY to make him not be quite so bouncy when he see those he knows and really likes...he is still puppy at 1 1/2 and an aussie...!   marne

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
tess in the burbs

Ds will take test 2 Monday.  He did great on the review questions.

 

Where on the website are the extra questions?

 

 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka
12 hours ago, Derf said:

I had to edit as i wasn't finsished giving you the whole story...and wammo the computer decided all by itself that i was done.....:swoon::yes::girlhaha:  anyhow  yes it is really good to socialize puppies...and I even took Sky over to our breeders again when he a about 3 months old to see if he knew what to do with the baby goats....yup....he did!  I took him back this summer and we showed him sheep and introduced him to things a bit...and it is there. i also have had around our calves and he SEES cows all the time when outside and taken him in the barn on leash when they are milking and so far no fear of those BIG holsteins. Course when he gets kicked the 1st time will tell the story...but it WILL happen as that is normal and will see if he is still ok with it. They either get fearful, or just keep on working or even get mad and chomp the cow one. Our older aussies at age 1 1/2 got mad and chomped the cow.m when kicked the 1st time..he has no fear of cows at all...and seems to know how to protect himself instinctively now. He is really sharp.

We had Sky at a obedience class at age 9 months...he did VERY well...got 2nd place in the class and again when people come i make sure he is around them and TRY to make him not be quite so bouncy when he see those he knows and really likes...he is still puppy at 1 1/2 and an aussie...!   marne

We definitely waited too long to train our pup.  Listened to bad advice. 

Funny about the baby goats.  The people we bought our dog from kept goats specifically to train the Border Collies!

And aw, I'm thinking of the poor dogs getting kicked by the holsteins, but I guess they have to learn.   I hope my dog learned not to mess with snakes after being bitten by that copperhead...

Edited by Mazurka

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka
On 9/15/2018 at 10:16 PM, tess in the burbs said:

Ds will take test 2 Monday.  He did great on the review questions.

 

Where on the website are the extra questions?

 

 

Here, @tess in the burbs.   Click on the links for Chapter Two and then scroll to the bottom of the page.

https://bereanbuilders.com/ecomm/online-content/discovering-design-with-chemistry/

Edited by Mazurka

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka

I've given Ben a couple of extra days to prepare for the Chapter 2 test.  He's finished all of the extra practice problems and will use tomorrow as a study day before taking the test on Wednesday.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
tess in the burbs
1 hour ago, Mazurka said:

I've given Ben a couple of extra days to prepare for the Chapter 2 test.  He's finished all of the extra practice problems and will use tomorrow as a study day before taking the test on Wednesday.

Ok, ds studied a little each day this weekend. Did review as scheduled before weekend. Made a 90 on test 2! First try.  Very proud.  I think he is figuring out he can achieve good grades with effort.   

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Gilead

Our first test in chem was a 74%, BU DD is happy because it is higher than most of her biology test scores the first semester of last year. I am glad, though, that she is aiming to improve it. The BJU has daily online reading and videos assigned in the schedule so it's easy to know where you need to be. Plus our subscription runs for one calendar year. This is good since Chemistry is the class in which we got the latest start.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka
22 hours ago, tess in the burbs said:

Ok, ds studied a little each day this weekend. Did review as scheduled before weekend. Made a 90 on test 2! First try.  Very proud.  I think he is figuring out he can achieve good grades with effort.   

That's awesome!  Good for him. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka
5 hours ago, Gilead said:

Our first test in chem was a 74%, BU DD is happy because it is higher than most of her biology test scores the first semester of last year. I am glad, though, that she is aiming to improve it. The BJU has daily online reading and videos assigned in the schedule so it's easy to know where you need to be. Plus our subscription runs for one calendar year. This is good since Chemistry is the class in which we got the latest start.

I think it can often be tough at the beginning of a course as students learn to figure out what is required. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Blessed by His grace

We just got back from our missionary conference in Thailand. It was a refreshing week of teaching, fellowship, and yummy food.  My friend from the States brought us a mass scale. My dd will go back and do a few experiments from chapter 1 and one from chapter 2 that required a mass scale. She started the first few lessons in chapter 2 before the conference-- not ideal, but I didn't want her to get too far behind the schedule. Last summer she was finishing up her science from her 10th grade year. I'm reading the lessons in chemistry as well so I can help her. My  oldest dd did it on her own without any help but this dd needs the extra help. I'm actually enjoying the course.

I hope everyone is enjoying their weekend. Thanks for starting this thread.

Edited by Blessed by His grace

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Jen in ME

Well, after doing Apologia General Science, Physical Science, and Biology, we have decided to switch programs.  We spent over 3 weeks with Apologia Chemistry and she had tears every day.  We finally decided that it is just not a good fit for her learning style.

So we started ChemExplained, which is a math based science program similar to Teaching Textbooks.  They have an 8-12 minute lecture with notes that the child fills in.  They have a Foundational, Traditional and Honors track.  We are doing the first lesson, which is free, including all the worksheets, notes, test and answer keys.  So far, this seems to be a much better match. 

I've never not done Apologia for High School.  It was a good match for my older dd.  I'm feeling a little conflicted but also really relieved.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka
1 minute ago, Jen in ME said:

Well, after doing Apologia General Science, Physical Science, and Biology, we have decided to switch programs.  We spent over 3 weeks with Apologia Chemistry and she had tears every day.  We finally decided that it is just not a good fit for her learning style.

So we started ChemExplained, which is a math based science program similar to Teaching Textbooks.  They have an 8-12 minute lecture with notes that the child fills in.  They have a Foundational, Traditional and Honors track.  We are doing the first lesson, which is free, including all the worksheets, notes, test and answer keys.  So far, this seems to be a much better match. 

I've never not done Apologia for High School.  It was a good match for my older dd.  I'm feeling a little conflicted but also really relieved.

Sounds like an interesting program.  I hope you'll share more as your daughter progresses.

I might divert from Apologia Biology for my Ben, too.  He is loving chemistry, and will probably like physics, but he has no interest in biology.  Still, I think he should do biology.  So I may try Friendly Biology with him, since apparently it is a little more relaxed than Apologia.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka

Sigh.  Today I graded the worst exam either of my kids have ever taken.  Ben made something like a 56 or 58 on his chem test.  So unusual for him.  I guess he's been rushing through his work without understanding.  I'll probably have to get more involved which is a bummer.  Ben has basically been doing science on his own for a couple of years. 

I'm not even sure what to do now.  My Dh thinks he didn't really spend the necessary time reading the chapter.  I guess I can have him read it over again, but what do I do for more practice problems?

I've already e-mailed Berean Builders to see if I can get one of those alternative tests that have been mentioned.  I'm really bummed and saddened by this.  I guess I can have him take the alternate test and then average the two grades?  This is what is suggested with Lifepacs, so maybe I'll borrow the idea for chemistry.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Blessed by His grace
1 hour ago, Mazurka said:

Sigh.  Today I graded the worst exam either of my kids have ever taken.  Ben made something like a 56 or 58 on his chem test.  So unusual for him.  I guess he's been rushing through his work without understanding.  I'll probably have to get more involved which is a bummer.  Ben has basically been doing science on his own for a couple of years. 

I'm not even sure what to do now.  My Dh thinks he didn't really spend the necessary time reading the chapter.  I guess I can have him read it over again, but what do I do for more practice problems?

I've already e-mailed Berean Builders to see if I can get one of those alternative tests that have been mentioned.  I'm really bummed and saddened by this.  I guess I can have him take the alternate test and then average the two grades?  This is what is suggested with Lifepacs, so maybe I'll borrow the idea for chemistry.

Berean Builders has practice problems for each module. Look at the introduction in the book. It has the information there on how to access it. I think that’s a good idea about averaging the two test scores together. This is a challenging course, so I don’t think we have to do it exactly as written. I’m even letting my dd choose a few modules to do open book. She’s learning a lot, but it’s not easy for her. My oldest dd did chemistry by herself. I’m having to read everything so I can help my second dd. I’m enjoying learning along with her. Dr. Wile makes it interesting and understandable. 

I’m sure Ben will find the alternate tests easier. Hang in there!

Edited by Blessed by His grace
  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Jen in ME
9 hours ago, Mazurka said:

Sigh.  Today I graded the worst exam either of my kids have ever taken.  Ben made something like a 56 or 58 on his chem test.  So unusual for him.  I guess he's been rushing through his work without understanding.  I'll probably have to get more involved which is a bummer.  Ben has basically been doing science on his own for a couple of years. 

I'm not even sure what to do now.  My Dh thinks he didn't really spend the necessary time reading the chapter.  I guess I can have him read it over again, but what do I do for more practice problems?

I've already e-mailed Berean Builders to see if I can get one of those alternative tests that have been mentioned.  I'm really bummed and saddened by this.  I guess I can have him take the alternate test and then average the two grades?  This is what is suggested with Lifepacs, so maybe I'll borrow the idea for chemistry.

Well, at the risk of sounding like the slacker of the group, I would call the bad test a "review" and I would let the alternate test be the "real" test. 

The point is for him to learn the chemistry.  If he knows it by the second test then that was how long it took him to know it.  The consequence is that it took him longer to get through the module.  I used the alternate exams in Apologia in Physical Science and Biology as a practice/review.

I know that our children won't get this opportunity for personalized mastery in college, but Ben is not in college.  He's homeschooled :)

But of course, you are his mom and you get to make this call.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Derf

Perfectly acceptable to average the tests..or eve give him another try after some more work to just try again...Video Text algebra ( which is endorsed by Dr wile) has more than one TEST for each of their modules ...it is expected to use them ...1st one that doesn't get a mastery level grade is just a practice to see if your ready....if not....do more learning and then take the 2nd one...and nothing seems to be said about AVERAGING them either on the video of how to use the course. I checked it out when SL again added it into their math offerings as i was curious what it was. it had been dropped i believe in favor of Teaching Textbooks, and i am assuming that when they were no long able to offer TT it was the next best thing offer along with MUS to give more choices for high school math. I suspect Dr wile wrote the addition test for the same reason....   Marne

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Blessed by His grace
35 minutes ago, Jen in ME said:

Well, at the risk of sounding like the slacker of the group, I would call the bad test a "review" and I would let the alternate test be the "real" test. 

The point is for him to learn the chemistry.  If he knows it by the second test then that was how long it took him to know it.  The consequence is that it took him longer to get through the module.  I used the alternate exams in Apologia in Physical Science and Biology as a practice/review.

I know that our children won't get this opportunity for personalized mastery in college, but Ben is not in college.  He's homeschooled :)

But of course, you are his mom and you get to make this call.

You’re definitely not a slacker! It’s nice to be in a chat with you again. 

4 minutes ago, Derf said:

Perfectly acceptable to average the tests..or eve give him another try after some more work to just try again...Video Text algebra ( which is endorsed by Dr wile) has more than one TEST for each of their modules ...it is expected to use them ...1st one that doesn't get a mastery level grade is just a practice to see if your ready....if not....do more learning and then take the 2nd one...and nothing seems to be said about AVERAGING them either on the video of how to use the course. I checked it out when SL again added it into their math offerings as i was curious what it was. it had been dropped i believe in favor of Teaching Textbooks, and i am assuming that when they were no long able to offer TT it was the next best thing offer along with MUS to give more choices for high school math. I suspect Dr wile wrote the addition test for the same reason....   Marne

I agree. Either choice would be acceptable. I’m definitely more creative with grading the high school level sciences this time around. 

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka
20 hours ago, Blessed by His grace said:

Berean Builders has practice problems for each module. Look at the introduction in the book. It has the information there on how to access it.

I think that’s a good idea about averaging the two test scores together. This is a challenging course, so I don’t think we have to do it exactly as written. I’m even letting my dd choose a few modules to do open book. She’s learning a lot, but it’s not easy for her. My oldest dd did chemistry by herself. I’m having to read everything so I can help my second dd. I’m enjoying learning along with her. Dr. Wile makes it interesting and understandable. 

I’m sure Ben will find the alternate tests easier. Hang in there!

He's already done the extra practice problems. I always have him do them before the test.  Today I had him watch some of the explanatory videos on the website, and I'm going to suggest that he re-read portions of the text tomorrow, and either re-work some of the practice problems without looking at the answer key, or carefully study the problems in the book. 

I hope he can take the make-up test this weekend, so we won't get too off-schedule.  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka
13 hours ago, Jen in ME said:

Well, at the risk of sounding like the slacker of the group, I would call the bad test a "review" and I would let the alternate test be the "real" test. 

The point is for him to learn the chemistry.  If he knows it by the second test then that was how long it took him to know it.  The consequence is that it took him longer to get through the module.  I used the alternate exams in Apologia in Physical Science and Biology as a practice/review.

I know that our children won't get this opportunity for personalized mastery in college, but Ben is not in college.  He's homeschooled :)

But of course, you are his mom and you get to make this call.

I always like hearing advice and suggestions from others!  It really helps me in my decision making.  

I was just so shocked!  I had never seen a grade like that before in my homeschool, and Ben is my diligent child.  I do think he has a bit of teenage brain right now, and he always seems sleepy.  He says he sleeps well enough (goes to bed around 10 o'clock and gets up at 7:30 or so), but maybe he is in one of those teenage growth spurts.  

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka
12 hours ago, Derf said:

Perfectly acceptable to average the tests..or eve give him another try after some more work to just try again...Video Text algebra ( which is endorsed by Dr wile) has more than one TEST for each of their modules ...it is expected to use them ...1st one that doesn't get a mastery level grade is just a practice to see if your ready....if not....do more learning and then take the 2nd one...and nothing seems to be said about AVERAGING them either on the video of how to use the course. I checked it out when SL again added it into their math offerings as i was curious what it was. it had been dropped i believe in favor of Teaching Textbooks, and i am assuming that when they were no long able to offer TT it was the next best thing offer along with MUS to give more choices for high school math. I suspect Dr wile wrote the addition test for the same reason....   Marne

Thank you for the encouragement.   I think at this point I need more support than Ben, lol.  I was very careful not to get upset with him, because he can be sensitive and feel badly if he doesn't do well, and I didn't want to make him feel bad. 

 

  • Like 3

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka
12 hours ago, Blessed by His grace said:

I’m definitely more creative with grading the high school level sciences this time around. 

I've gotten better about this sort of thing, too, as I've seen how other teachers grade things.  I really love some of the adjustments that I've seen "out there,"  and it's given me more confidence to adjust things myself.

Even in my older son's community college classes, the teachers often allow the students to drop one quiz, or they offer some extra credit, or extra activities to help pull up their grades.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Derf

Amazing....I think my kiddo could flunk or nearly flunk anything and it wouldn't bother him....he just is NOT interested in school. I finally told him IF his science grade...( it was General Science from apologia IF I remember right....) was not at least a C something he was not going to watch any TV till it was at least a C- for two tests  ( it was during football season...and that was positively a good incentive to NOT loose that ability) . I had already modified the tests and made the grading scale more reasonable for our situation as i knew  it was a tough class for him. we got thru Physical Science for his 9th grade year...with finishing it up in 10th grade as i had also slowed down the schedule as i found with him that huge masses of information just shuts him down....he had to feel like it was doable to even try.

When we hit biology....i had spent the summer reading the biology book and trying to adapt the material and tests to fit him better as Biology really was a huge step up from Physical and general Science. We tried but i could see him really starting to hate a very interesting subject due to the depth of the material and the amount of things being presented. I was and had done a lot of work to have him by now struggle like he was and he really hated science now, so when i found Friendly biology....we switched and it was a breath of fresh air for him...and he is really learning and not feeling it is impossible to do and therefore much easier to get him to apply himself. we will finish up the rest of Friendly biology ( got a late start with it due to trying to swim our way thru Apologia biology) ( i left the human biology part to do this fall) later this fall .I also bought friendly Chemistry when i learned of Friendly biology as after reading thru some of Discovering design with chemistry that Dr wile wrote, i knew that it was way above his math ability ( We are still working thru MUS algebra...and believe it or not it is finally starting to click with him) and need and interest .

The point is....IF you keep hitting a wall with Dr wiles book....and it is good...but again it is difficult material presented VERY well explained with a lot of things to help them understand and internalize ...but it is difficult...and I found if i build a good foundation with material  that is applicable to my students ability and interest and need....they will have a foundation that CAN be built upon to build higher later if they so desire. the problem is to find what is the right material to build that foundation....which is dependent upon need, ability and even the background of past experience for that student. So if you keep on having problems...don't be afraid to find what will work better for your student.....there are many choices and its not anything to feel bad about if you have to backup and find another road thru as they say>   Marne

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka
3 minutes ago, Derf said:

.he had to feel like it was doable to even try.

I understand this.  

3 minutes ago, Derf said:

 

The point is....IF you keep hitting a wall with Dr wiles book....and it is good...but again it is difficult material presented VERY well explained with a lot of things to help them understand and internalize ...but it is difficult...and I found if i build a good foundation with material  that is applicable to my students ability and interest and need....they will have a foundation that CAN be built upon to build higher later if they so desire. the problem is to find what is the right material to build that foundation....which is dependent upon need, ability and even the background of past experience for that student. So if you keep on having problems...don't be afraid to find what will work better for your student.....there are many choices and its not anything to feel bad about if you have to backup and find another road thru as they say>   Marne

Good point.  

I think he will be OK, because he is very science minded and likes the course.  He's just been getting careless lately. (Although carelessness only accounts for some of the problems he missed.)  I have not studied with him with science for quite a while -- I've kind of left him to his own devices, but I think I need to step in a bit and make sure he takes better care setting up his problems.   I've been trying to get him to check the comprehension check problems as he goes along, but he's not been very diligent about it.   I need to make sure he is checking them as he goes, or I need to take over for a while and go back to checking them myself.  It might not be a bad idea, because perhaps I can spot things in his work that he might not be aware of.  

 

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Blessed by His grace
2 hours ago, Mazurka said:

I've gotten better about this sort of thing, too, as I've seen how other teachers grade things.  I really love some of the adjustments that I've seen "out there,"  and it's given me more confidence to adjust things myself.

Even in my older son's community college classes, the teachers often allow the students to drop one quiz, or they offer some extra credit, or extra activities to help pull up their grades.

My oldest dd is in her second year of university and has taken chemistry, organic chemistry, anatomy and physiology 1 and 2, and now microbiology. All the professors have creative ways to help students—dropping lowest quiz and/or test, extra credit on tests and quizzes, extra activities, participation points etc. I help my students too if they are doing their best and not slacking off. My dd felt like Dr. Wile’s courses helped her prepare for her college science classes. Her last micro test covered 8 chapters from the book plus lectures. She’s currently trying to get in the nursing program. She just found out she made it to the interview stage. Now they’re down to 90 applicants and 80 spots. Her closest friends all got interviews.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka
9 hours ago, Blessed by His grace said:

My oldest dd is in her second year of university and has taken chemistry, organic chemistry, anatomy and physiology 1 and 2, and now microbiology. All the professors have creative ways to help students—dropping lowest quiz and/or test, extra credit on tests and quizzes, extra activities, participation points etc. I help my students too if they are doing their best and not slacking off. My dd felt like Dr. Wile’s courses helped her prepare for her college science classes. Her last micro test covered 8 chapters from the book plus lectures. She’s currently trying to get in the nursing program. She just found out she made it to the interview stage. Now they’re down to 90 applicants and 80 spots. Her closest friends all got interviews.

My older son feels the same way about Dr. Wile's courses.  He is taking General Biology at the CC this semester, and he is very well-prepared for the class.  While he is learning things beyond the scope of Wile's books, the class is much easier for him due to the thorough teaching of Wile.  What I was surprised by is how much chemistry he needed to know for a beginning biology class.  I'm so glad he had chemistry, and not just biology, before taking this class.

ETA:  Good luck to your daughter with the nursing program!

Edited by Mazurka

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Jen in ME
On ‎10‎/‎4‎/‎2018 at 9:16 AM, Blessed by His grace said:

You’re definitely not a slacker! It’s nice to be in a chat with you again. 

 

It's nice to "see" you, too!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka

Well, he's taking the make-up exam right now.  We'll see how he does.  Don't know what I'll do if this test is also poor, but I guess I'll cross that bridge when I get to it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka

He got a 95 on the make-up test, although I do think it was easier than the regular test.  I'm glad that he did well, though, so he can move on to the next chapter.  I was afraid he was going to get bogged down for a while.

  • Like 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Derf

YEA! Good job ...it seemed to me when we got the "easier" tests for biology, General and physical science that apologia used to have...that some of them were harder that the original ones.......maybe it just used material that you were more familiar with or understood better....anyway excellent job!

Marne

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Blessed by His grace
3 hours ago, Mazurka said:

He got a 95 on the make-up test, although I do think it was easier than the regular test.  I'm glad that he did well, though, so he can move on to the next chapter.  I was afraid he was going to get bogged down for a while.

Yay! That’s great news! Even if it was easier, he had to understand the concepts to get a 95. 

Edited by Blessed by His grace
  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka
21 hours ago, Derf said:

YEA! Good job ...it seemed to me when we got the "easier" tests for biology, General and physical science that apologia used to have...that some of them were harder that the original ones.......maybe it just used material that you were more familiar with or understood better....anyway excellent job!

Marne

 

18 hours ago, Blessed by His grace said:

Yay! That’s great news! Even if it was easier, he had to understand the concepts to get a 95. 

Thank you!  I really appreciate the encouragement and support.

On to a new chapter tomorrow!

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
kemah

Jumping on this thread late, but it has encouraged me greatly.  I have my dd15 and ds13 taking Dr. Wile's newer Chemistry this year together.  They are both ready and I thought it would provide some good partnership between the two of them.  We traveled a bit the past two weeks, so they are just taking their Chapter 2 test tomorrow.  My dd is no issue, but my ds has some compliance struggles at this point.  Reading this thread, I realize that others deal with this, as well.  Thank you all for sharing.  You gave me some ideas to tuck in my back pocket to use with him. 

 

Do any of you do a "review" session with your students prior to taking tests?  A  review time the day before?

 

Susan--where are the alternative tests?  And thank you for sharing the link for the extra problems.  How have I not known this before? : )  

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka
8 minutes ago, kemah said:

Jumping on this thread late, but it has encouraged me greatly.  I have my dd15 and ds13 taking Dr. Wile's newer Chemistry this year together.  They are both ready and I thought it would provide some good partnership between the two of them.  We traveled a bit the past two weeks, so they are just taking their Chapter 2 test tomorrow.  My dd is no issue, but my ds has some compliance struggles at this point.  Reading this thread, I realize that others deal with this, as well.  Thank you all for sharing.  You gave me some ideas to tuck in my back pocket to use with him. 

 

Do any of you do a "review" session with your students prior to taking tests?  A  review time the day before?

 

 

Susan--where are the alternative tests?  And thank you for sharing the link for the extra problems.  How have I not known this before? : )  

I used to be more diligent about having a review session prior to the test, but Ben has been working well on his own for the past year or so, so I stopped.  I think I will start again, however.  I'm so grateful Will is taking Biology at the community college this year and I don't have to be involved in that.  Woohoo!  I think I said upthread that Wile's Biology as well as his new chemistry have been great preparation for Will's biology class at the CC. 

Here is a link for the extra problems.  Click on the appropriate chapter, and then scroll to the bottom for the extra problems and answer sheets.

https://bereanbuilders.com/ecomm/online-content/discovering-design-with-chemistry/

Edited by Mazurka

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
kemah
15 hours ago, Mazurka said:

I used to be more diligent about having a review session prior to the test, but Ben has been working well on his own for the past year or so, so I stopped.  I think I will start again, however.  I'm so grateful Will is taking Biology at the community college this year and I don't have to be involved in that.  Woohoo!  I think I said upthread that Wile's Biology as well as his new chemistry have been great preparation for Will's biology class at the CC. 

Here is a link for the extra problems.  Click on the appropriate chapter, and then scroll to the bottom for the extra problems and answer sheets.

https://bereanbuilders.com/ecomm/online-content/discovering-design-with-chemistry/

Thank you!  Do you have a separate link for the alternative tests?  I didn't see them listed there.  

Dd15 doesn't really need a review from me, but ds13 does at this point.  Capability is fine, but we are dealing with a mite of stubbornness :rolleyes:, so I think this helps our communication with the chem right now. I think it helps him focus appropriately.  

Thanks for your help.  And good to know that you feel like these are good prep courses for high school.

Edited by kemah

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mazurka
6 hours ago, kemah said:

Thank you!  Do you have a separate link for the alternative tests?  I didn't see them listed there.  

You have to e-mail and ask for the alternative tests. I requested mine in the evening, and I had them by the next morning.

6 hours ago, kemah said:

Dd15 doesn't really need a review from me, but ds13 does at this point.  Capability is fine, but we are dealing with a mite of stubbornness :rolleyes:, so I think this helps our communication with the chem right now. I think it helps him focus appropriately.  

Thanks for your help.  And good to know that you feel like these are good prep courses for high school.

I really think this is a hard program for a 13 year old, even a capable one.  There is so much to learn and process and manipulate.  So that might have something to do with the stubbornness. Just a thought.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
catbrown

Well, ds is also doing chemistry this year after doing biology with Apologia(very rigorous but we made it through, lol,)

and Physics last year (used Abeka) only his Dad was his teacher.

So this year, chemistry he chose, but from a different curriculum:  Master Class: Chemistry from Master books.

Going pretty well, except his last quiz he did bomb out(I think it's a given sometimes with these hard subjects) but

he's been doing well on all other quizzes and labs so I believe it evened out.  Dh was able to go over with him what he

missed.  It was basically not understanding or catching on how to do the problems/solutions, something about moles and grams.

So for this year, this subject seems/appears to be a 3-way street. lol.  Which just means most of it he does independently or what

he can do, I help him if needed and I can help him with, mainly just tell/give him the assignment for the given day, and then dh

helps with any problems he doesn't understand, and does the labs along with him(except I did the 1st one with him, cause it just

required a box and something hidden in it without him knowing. lol)  So dhs' job is to do the labs with him, or find a video for him

to watch instead(so he's done a few physical labs) a couple of video's etc.

  • Like 1

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites